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the brand new, all glittering 80/10/10 - 30 day challenge

well…guess the title says it all

june the 1st…for 30 days….this is your roll call

i thought it may be fun, interesting, painful and whatever else to start a thread for those interested in giving 80/10/10 (which from now on shall be referred to 811) a little trial….30 days seems to be the norm these days….what better way than to start in june (30 days have september, apr….....)

i would like for it NOT to be an area to debate the 811 in principle, but just an area for those keen to give it a go to share their experience

though it is helpful to do so, many of you won’t have read the book yet….at the end of this post i’ll post links to other blogs , sites that will help in this area….i also have the book on hand and will use it to try and answer queations as close as i can…..failing that (and, ideally) the vegsource forum will become one of your new friends

i guess you can use this space as you see fit….journal daily, weekly or just pop by anytime you have a doubt or problem or just to check in from time to time….journal your weightloss (or not)...favourite new fruits or your new found favourite way to exercise

which leads me to one of the few requirements…...

food is only one part of the 811 picture…..also extremely important is adequate exercise (from here on to be referred to as activity), rest, fresh air(or as best as you can…city anyone???)...and sunshine (again..as best you can)

of all of these…the activity is of prime importance…get this right and the other things will follow…or at least they will if you exercise outside :o)


on a daily basis , incorporate some form of activity, EXTRA to what you do…if, like me , you do next to nothing, then you have many options….if you already have some form of routine, try stepping it up a bit

activity in this lifestyle, creates the need and desire to take in more calories and is quite essential


calories ????

well i’m not gonna make a huge deal about this because it tends to cause many problems….some have philosophical objections to calorie counting…others have issues that are worsened by this practice

all i can say is that eating to fuel our needs is important and may be the key to the long-term success of this lifestyle…but take it at your own pace

it is only intended to be in the early stages so that you can get an idea of the volume of food that you may need to AIM to consume (remember, it may be something we need to work towards if we aren’t used to eating that much)

for those who wanna know

1) it is a good idea to get a rough idea of our bmr (basal metabolic rate)...this is how much , in calories, our body expends daily (AT REST)


this will give you a rough idea

2) get familiar with a calorie counter…be it a book, nutridiary or (my favourite)- cron-o-meter


...i have this for macintosh but it’s available as a free download for windows also….it’s a great, self-contained, program


i must stress, calorie counting is for the early stages only…..but you may become hooked (like me) in seeing what your daily diet is giving me in vits and mins (never realised the word vitamins came from the combination…doh !!)

THAT’S IT…...i think

so…unplug your dehydrators, tell you juicers that you’ll see them in a months time (maybe)....and join me

remember it’s just an experiment…30 days and you can do whatever you want in july

one more thing….if you FALL (not fail…failing is when you fall, but don’t get up again)....don’t disappear….keep posting….let us know what happened…let us all benefit by learning from your experience

here are some links

this first post will be the primary hub for links….as i, or you , uncover more links to articles/blogs/sites of interest, i will update this first post to reflect…it will save people having to dive through everything to find links

so, let’s start with 2 good’uns

http://foodnsport.com/joomla/....(doug’s own site)

http://www.vegsource.com/talk/raw/ i will often encourage you to post here for more experiened answers, including from dr.d himself

this is a link to download a pdf of an interview that doug gave to kevin gianni during last years raw summit


and the audio…thanks simon…...




  • MOTHMOTH Raw Newbie

    I’m so in!

    I get very excited at the thought of a challenge, hehe. Particularly 811, since it seems so freeing.

    Thanks for the links!

  • nycgrrlnycgrrl Raw Newbie

    can you explain this diet to me? i’v ebeen looking at the links, but can’t find a concise description of the diet. thank you!

    eta: i just read the pdf. very interesting! I would like to try this. I will still eat very occasional nuts, but that’s okay, right? fruit and veggeis—easy!!

  • I would be so in on this, I really want to give it a go – but alas, I am cleansing right now. Have fun, everyone!

  • RawKRawK Raw Newbie

    hey guys, we are down. however, we will be finishing up the leftover avocados and traveling until June 9th, so it will start then. also, i should like to read Graham’s book and that will arrive shortly. we are finishing up a 30 day 100% raw challenge and it is/was awesome. i only suspect it will be better with more fruits.

    side note: i tried 100% raw about a year ago and thought it was so difficult. it was only because i thought i needed to mimic a 3 course meal every night. yeah veggie spaghetti and raw breads are nice, but not always feasible on a busy schedule. it wasn’t until this time, when i realized simplicity is best, that raw food came easy. i suspect 811 takes this principle to its rational extreme.

    thanks for the heads up on 811 and thanks to all on this site for information. knowledge truly is addictive.

  • woe…great start

    MOTH….great to see ya…..i’m excited too….i tried alissas 30 day challenge once (811) style….i didn’t last very long…it becomes quite hard when you read everyones daily journals e.g

    today i started off with raw chocolate ice cream for breakfast…who’d have thought

    blah blah blah….i found it very hard to look at my bananas objectively….disaster

    AlyssaDyane…wish you well with your cleanse..thanks for responding anyway….maybe when you finish you could jump in…what better way to proceed after cleansing

    nycgrrl….hmmmm…in a nutshell, huh ???

    well, here goes

    your aiming to feed the bodies calorie needs as closely as possible, using a diet made up of fruit and tender greens with minimal fats….what is important is that the ratio of 80/10/10 (811) is followed

    this is a ratio of nutrients…the 80 represents carbs, the first ‘10’ represents protein and the last ‘10’ is for fat



    this ratio works as a percentage of total calories


    if you were to eat a thousand calories in a day…..you would (as a minimum) consume 800 calories as carbs…a maximum of 100 calories as protein and a maximum of 100 calories of fat

    to get an idea of what various foods contain, it’s worth investing a little time to familarise yourself, using something like nutridiary

    dr dougs motto goes something like this

    whole, raw ,ripe ,fresh ,organic…one at a time…until full

    whole: the whole food…not juicing..the exception is orange juice with a normal citrus juicer that retains a lot of the fibre

    raw: self explanatory, though you may need to verify if your nuts are raw (if you wish to eat them)

    ripe : very important..unripe fruit digests badly and doesn’t contain enough ready sugar to satisfy

    fresh : s/e

    organic : when possible…for me , it’s next to impossible…if you want to try and balance it, then things like bananas are better ‘non’ organic cos of the skin….same with oranges and any fruit that you discard the peel ….if you have good organic available and can afford it, then lettuce, toms cukes etc are better off organic….try your best

    this is optimal…..mono-mealing makes for a satisfactory, easily digested meal…but you don’t always have to follow it….initially your body may be less sensitive to bad combinations, but it’s worth looking into the wealth of food combining info on the web

    you can eat nuts….you just have to be very careful…..if you under eat calories and become hungry, even 2 buckets of nuts will ‘go down’ good

    the fat percentage is an average….you’d be better off NOT consuming them every day…but allow a couple of days a week where you consume them in excess of the 10 %...this will be a ‘treat’ and will also allow you to notice any changes on ‘fat’ days than others…avocados are abetter source of fat, but if you can get good quality, really raw nuts, then why not

    i have never been a huge fan of avocados, but i’ll probably consume the odd 1/2 if i feel i need to

    when you become more familiar with the nutritional makeup of natural foods, you will see that most fruits and greens have carbs, protein and fat in perfect percentages…who’d of thunk it…fat in lettuce and also oranges it is with this realisation that many 811’ers go for very long periods with no ‘overt fats’(other than what’s present in fruit and greens)...many find that they begin to digest even easier like this

    a word on condiments…..DON’T USE THEM…at least for this 30 days….absolutely no salt….EVEN sea salt or the hugely expensive pack of pink himalayan sea salt you had to get a 2nd mortgage for…..

    no other spices also, and try to steer clear of any herbs….

    really….just for 30 days…then you can do as you wish…...

    i don’t want to get into the why’s or wherefores here in this post, but just trust me on this one…..what we are trying to do is re-sensitize our tastes so that they begin to work in our favour….all the above desensitize our taste buds and make the natural foods seem blander than they are…..if we are to depend on this as our diet, we need to re-gain all of our senses

    i don’t expect everyone to do so, but i’m gonna be ‘anal’ about posting my nutritional data for this 30 days, both for my benefit and of others…you’ll be able to see what i eat and what it provides

    feel free to ask whatever, whenever….ideas for meals, simple recipes etc

    if you’re interested in doing this , then go to the 1st link and work out your rough calorie target (bmr calculator)....then download the cron-o-meter programme (link provided)...this will be what i use to present my data….i’ll probably post a guide to using it if anyones interested…it’s real easy and surprisingly fun too

    if you don’t care for this…tell me what your bmr works out and i’ll try to give you some examples of what a day may look like

    good luck

    hasta domingo ,mi companeros


  • if ya can get hold of the book, it will really help

    this goes for everyone

  • and RAWK, you’re welcome to join when you can

    see ya then

  • nycgrrlnycgrrl Raw Newbie

    sounds interesting. i might give it a whirl. don’t want to get obsessive, but it sounds like it might be fun! what’s the diff between cronometer and nutridiary (i get that one is off line and one is online, but any other significant differences? one better than the otehr for raw food?) thanks!

  • I am glad you posted this thread. I actually am expecting the 801010 book to arrive today. However, although I would really like to do this, I have a lot of social obligations that i feel will interfere with my attempts. I think I will still attempt for the 30 days, but I have to be realistic and know that there are some events (being thrown a going away part where SAD food will be presented in my honor) that I just can’t see a way out of…but that is 1 day in 30, so I can strive to see how i do the other 29 days. So….I guess I am in! Starting June 1? Sorry that wound up being so bloggy :) I am excited to try this out though!

  • MOTHMOTH Raw Newbie

    Hey el-bo – is onion a spice? I have no problems omitting it from my diet since I pretty much already got my “fix” recently, and plus I can just eat lots of celery, but I was just wondering!

    And what about hot peppers, like jalapeno?

  • I was actually planning on starting this next week so I’m really excited about seeing this post. My bookstore doesn’t have the book but I’m going out of town today so I’ll stop somewhere and get it. I’m finally out of school so I’m starting a whole new work out plan and everything. this will be great to add!!

  • MOTH…try for the 30 days to avoid onions and chilis especially…they really numb the taste buds and these intense flavourings become addictive , over time…....remember after 30 days, alls good….check out steve pavlinas blog (link above) he followed it to the letter, and from what i remember, it was re-introducing these spices that gave him quite a surprise…..don’t quote me on it, i have to re-read it myself

    chicagomama…...29 days of goodness is fine with me….welcome…enjoy your party….don’t tell us what you eat…don’t worry about the blog-ness…you can present yourself however you feel

    mallorymoore…..perfect timing , huh ????...enjoy the book and tell us about your workout plan

    here’s to sunday

  • here’s another link


    i’ll add it to the list of blogs on the first post

  • nycgrrlnycgrrl Raw Newbie

    how many grams of fiber do you find you generally consume. I haven’t eaten dinner yet and I am at 250% of the rda, so I’d like to change what 100% is in nutridiary. THanks.

  • OMG this is so amazing! I have been planning on starting my 811 on June 1 for quite some time! I’m preparing myself mentally right not and I’ll dive right in on June—with all you appearently. Im so excited now! I just set up a blog that will follow my journey if anyones interested.


    Thank you el-bo for starting this post! and good luck to all!

  • Bananna1333Bananna1333 Raw Newbie

    Well I will join too then, lol….even though I never succeed at the raw month challenges, this one is easier….

    I will eat green onions in my salad though, and have my herbal tea. Guess that’s kind of hypocritical…but I think they’re minor variations on the diet. Also, I’m a big water drinker, and Harley and I both agree on not depending on fruit for all your water, (for those who haven’t read the book, Doug says your water needs should be small and no need to drink a lot of it).

    So the start date is Sunday!

  • 2 more….perfect

    bananna…..welcome…drink all the water you need….play it by feel…i understand the arguments presented on both sides and i’m not gonna comment on it either way….and have your green onions…i wonder how long you’ll enjoy them as they will for sure be the only thing that will linger and repeat…..sarah on the going bananas blog used to do the same, now she just can’t stomach them…..guess you’ll need the dragon breath to control all them little kiddies….if you really don’t think you can’t survive without them for 30 days, fill your boots…you’ll still be 811

    naturally fruity….welcome….i meant to link to your blog, before…..i’ll paste the link into the 1st post….i didn’t have time to read it yet, but you seemed to have been doing 811 for a while…unless i have you confused with someone else

    nycgrrl…...here’s a link to a brief outline of the kind of day i might have….i’m gonna check tomorrow that it’s all calibrated correctly….i’ll look into nutridiary also…i just really love cron-o-meter….the las time i checked nutridiary, i’m sure it said that it wasn’t optimised for my browser or operating system (i’m a mac)...i’ll check again, tomorrow

    one thing to point out….we aren’t aiming to get absolutely every vitamin and mineral, every single day….just keep adding variety to try and balance out an average


  • o.k , naturally fruity…you aren’t who i thought you were…doesn’t matter…welcome

    i’ll link your blog in the first post…then i’m off to find the other blog that i confused yours with

    check out as many of the links above as you can stand

    see ya on sunday

  • found the other blog….it was ‘living fruity’, not ‘naturally fruity’......

    i’ve posted links to both on my first post


  • naturallyfruity….great blog….+1 for goingbananas…..

    will you be posting here regularly or just ‘linking’ to your blog ???

  • Hey, wow. I think I’ll give it a go as well. I got the book a few months ago, and even though it makes so much sense to me, I’ve yet to be able to stick to it for more than a week. I think the biggest issues are psychological – lack of support and pressure from family and friends when eating with them.

    It’s been a while since I tried and I’ve been thinking more and more about doing a 1 month trial. I think it can help when starting out if you can tell yourself it’s only for a set amount of time – otherwise the “This sucks, I’ll never be able to eat xxxxx again!” feeling kicks in and you fall off. (That’s what happens for me anyway.)

    So, Sunday it is for me too!


  • Hey el-bo I will be definitely checking in everyday but will write everything in my blog. More space, i can blab away ;) Im just starting it but the idea isn’t new with me..tried it once but wasn’t eating enough because I worried about weight too much. One tip: DONT WORRY ABOUT EATING TOO MUCH hope that helps

  • welcome gregX999….

    it is quite difficult….the longest i’ve managed was 10 days, but i really wasn’t getting enough calories and just felt so deprived…was having serious psycho / emotional resistance to what i knew made ‘too much’ sense…i finally caved a day before my birthday, cos i thought it would make me unhappy on my birthday….

    how wrong was i….i hadn’ t become sensitive enough to realise the benefits that i’d got in those 10 days….just focused on how ‘deprived’ i was….i had failed to notice that my depression had all but disappeared….i soon realised though as i ‘treated’ myself to a SAD food birthday…..all the badness came back like a smack to the head….i’ve been dizzy ever since

    i was laughing today with one of my flatmates about how i cannot back out now…now i’ve invited you all to my party, i’ve gotta show up…..for me , it’s about support, but it’s more a matter of pride….let me explain…i’ve never been that ‘pride’ type, but i’ve made such a stand for this recently, that i can think of nothing that will stop me…even if everyone leaves, i will make it to 30 days….if i can survive all the master cleanses that i have (true hell if you hate the taste of the lemonade), then 30 days eating the best food available is gonna be easy :o)

    if it’s true that it takes 21 days to break old, and learn new, habits…then if i get to the end of the month there is every possibility that i’d be able to continue

    good luck

    until sunday

  • yeah, you’re right , naturallyfruity

    ‘twas the reason i failed last time

    as far as weight loss…i have a ton to lose….and i’ve always become so desperate and gone for the quick fix (e.g the master cleanse i did a couple of weeks ago)

    i’m now just not worried anymore…it just doesn’t work….these cleanses foster a feeling of deprivation (for me, anyway)....when finished you have to be really careful about your next move

    i need something more sustainable long term….i know that that my weight is the main cause of my self esteem problems when eating SAD….but i truly believe that as my health improves with raw/811 that i will be just happier, regardless of the weight…it will become an aside….reading ‘goneraw’s’ own chris carlton’s story is a great inspiration for me….he’s all about the long game….philip mccluskey (welikeitraw.com) is another ex- ‘big guy’ that just went raw and everything else just took care of itself

    raw makes a lot of sense, but like others have experienced, i feel almost ‘cursed’ to have found 811…..it just makes so much sense (in theory) that it begs to be tried, even before ‘normal’ raw….just gotta cut straight to the core…straight to the essence

  • deborahanndeborahann Raw Newbie

    I’m in for a try. I did the raw diva detox a couple of weeks ago and felt great. From what I have read about 811, this detox seemed very similar. I have been pretty much sticking with it eating just a little added fat here and there and noticed that my walks are much easier (I don’t feel like I have cement posts for legs the 1st 1/2 mile!) and I don’t get the afternoon crash after lunch. The last 2 days saw a significant increase in fat (PMS cravings…UGH) intake with a noticeable decline in how good I felt when I exercised. I am past that now and back on the plan! I mentioned in another post that I was worried about blood sugar and I was able to check after a huge lunch. I got into the heavenly almond cinnamon balls(from this site) and probably ate a half recipe. This was after a large salad and 2 bananas. I had substituted dried figs and raisins for dates because that was all I had, so…lot’s of sugar. I have checked many times after way less food and been 160 or 170. I never went over 93 and I didn’t get that horrible foggy feeling either (at least not nearly as bad as usual). I ended up eating a bunch of almonds after lunch today and paid for it! apparently a 1 time slip is manageable but make it more routine and you pay. I also have far fewer and much less severe cravings eating like this. I am REALLY hoping that this is the answer to vibrant health and bounding energy I have been searching for for probably 10 years! I also have about 15 to 20 lbs to lose. I easily gain with gourmet type raw so I’m hoping this works.

    el-bo, I remember you stated earlier that you had some emotional issues with food. I do to. I am a compulsive and binge eater and it didn’t change just by going raw.I am really working through the emo. stuff and I think this is the key to gaining control. I highly recommend Raw Emotions by Angela Stokes

    Looking forward to everyone’s posts and progress.

  • you’re right about the one time slip being manageable…if you eat well fo a period, even a SAD food slip-up is quite manageable…but by the 3rd SAD meal you feel worse than ever, not helped any by the guilt

    in terms of my issues….i guess i have never had anything really diagnosed….just the usual case of numbing myself into oblivion…i’ve always been overweight, but it’s interesting for me to note that since finally quitting my 11 year, daily, marijuana habit, 5 years ago. i’ve gained approx 6 stone in weight…..i just swapped one habitual escape for another….

    i also try to overcompensate my failures….this week i fell miserably again…and promptly decided a water fast would help…..it’s this kind of thing that has finally become clear this week, i need to stop

    i’m glad that you are already feeling the benefits and becoming sensitive to the effects of ‘less than’ optimum foods

    glad you’re joining us

  • MOTHMOTH Raw Newbie

    Water fasting is so difficult. I got into a vicious cycle awhile back where I would fast for a few days, then binge, then fast, and then binge. I was binging on raw, but still = icky feelings. It messed everything up for me inside of my head. I became paranoid of gaining any weight and began having panic attacks. Both my body and my mind were very confused by that behavior.

    811 – low fat, high fruit – seems to be the only way I can eat that won’t kneejerk me into a fasting pattern like that. And eventually I will go on another serious fast (longest was ten straight days water), but I have to learn how to eat first.

    I just finished off my last hot peppers tonight in preparation for Sunday. I ended up burning my mouth and getting pissed off at them, so I don’t think I’ll have a problem giving them up. Tomorrow I’m getting a bunch of apples, bananas, watermelon, and oranges. I hope to mono-meal every day on a different fruit (with a day on celery), but as long as I stick to 811, I’ll be happy.

    el-bo – I also had a constant marijuana habit for about 5 years. I just quit about 2-3 months ago and sometimes I still feel the urge to toke up. I’m staying strong though…I believe 811 may help give me renewed focus on that.

  • nycgrrlnycgrrl Raw Newbie

    thanks for your link, el-bo. It seems cronometer actually details the vitamins and minerals of your day too, which i don’t think nutridiary does…but i don’t quite know if i want that much info—i might get too obsessive. might just want to eat more intuitively. Anyway, today was wonderful, was right on target for 811, and then I went out to eat with DH. Ate all raw, but a bit more olive oil than intended LOL..Still it was delicious..raw artichokes..imagine that. Yum.

    Still thinking about this, but certainly open-minded. I try to eat intuitively, but methinks my intuition is shot after 30 years of cooked food…:)

  • nycgrrl….i’ve also changed my thinking with regards to posting the info…..i’m still gonna use it as a rough guide for my benefit, but will probably only post the food i’ve eaten per day with calories consumed….i need to lose weight so i need to maintain a slight, but consistent calorie defecit

    "methinks my intuition is shot after 30 years of cooked food
  • nycgrrlnycgrrl Raw Newbie

    I have given it some thought, and I am in, with a caveat. I am sure there are going to be days where I add too much olive oil to my salad, or one too many avos. I am not going to worry about this at all, just try to move generally in the right direction of 80-10-10. I do think those figures are about right, although at times I may want to increase my protein a bit—I think the fat is just right. Still debating between cronometer and nutridiary.

    Thank you for this challenge. I look forward to tomorrow.

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