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US Presidential Debate


Personally, I think that anyone who plans to vote for McCain now has a hole in their head. As an American, I have to say that it’s embarrassing that he’s even a nominee.


  • Jellibi- your “hole in the head” comment made me laugh out loud! :)

    I (and then Mon46) commented about the debate on the “Definitely Not a Palin Fan” thread, so I’ll copy my post from there:

    “Wow. Watching the debate and Obama is SO blowing McCain away on so many levels. Very intersting to me to watch their body language: McCain refuses to look at Obama at all. He grits and tenses his jaw constantly, shifts his weight, and when he speake he says ” I want… I want….” but no actual specifics of what he WILL do, and when he smiles it seems more forced. On the other hand, Obama looks directly at McCain consistently- both while addressing his replies to Jim’s questions or addressing McCain’s accusations, and while McCain gives his replies to Jim he still looks at McCain. Obama is relaxed in his facial expressions, his stance, and when he chuckles. He also speaks in terms of “I WILL do (this or that)” and, overall, in a much more assertive, confident mannner, and more of the style of a leader- confident yet he is not being cruel, arrogant, or condescending towards McCain, as some poor excuses of leaders do towards their opposition.

    But then McCain is just another puppet- a follower of his higher ups, just as Bush Jr is, so it makes sense that he is not able to act in the manner of a true leader. It’s quite obvious to me that Obama actually THINKS for himself, thinks himself about the issues he is addressing (unlike McCain who is out of touch with middle class Americans), and believes in what he proposes and states, while McCain stammers, skirts around giving specific answers, attacks Obama (smoke screen distractions and stalling) instead of stating what he himself will do to change our situation, and has trouble saying what he will specifically do. McCain can only recite and regurgitate what he has been told and trained to say, it is not coming from a stance inner belief and steadfastness like it is with Obama.

    That’s my thoughts so far. :)

    Can only think that people who STILL woud vote for McCain are SO in denial and in the “fog of the sheeple” trance after seeing this. ...Oh. And, of course, the big medical corporations that Obama must have royally pissed off by saying he would cut their strings to the lobbyists and Medicaid money through their private contracts. heehee

    No Obama’s not perfect, no one could be-(and I sure would love to see the other parties allowed up there, too) but he sure as hell beats out McSame!

    Edit: How hilarious that Biden replied afterwards, but the GOP WON’T ALLOW Palin up there to comment! How flipping stupid are people who think she is capable when it’s clear the very own people who picked her as their puppet and distraction do not believe she is capable and can benefit her party’s stance (and chances) by commenting! They have to keep her on a leash and under tight cover lest the public see how incapable (and horrific) she truly is.”

  • And I will add my comment from the Palin thread:

    I loved the line when McCain said that he was not Miss Congeniality. I guess that’s why he needed to have Miss Congeniality in the form of Sarah Palin for vice president spokes model.

  • My husband told me that the “hole in the head” comment was mean, so I hurried home after walking our dog so that I could delete it. But, it’s too late now. Guess I’ll have to roll with the punches :)

    I should add: I am sorry if anyone finds it offensive though. In my naivety (as I was explaining to my husband) I was thinking, “Surely no one will vote for McCain now!” Meaning: no one will be offended by my hole in the head comment because clearly everyone sees that Obama is the better candidate. “No, my young jedi,” my husband said, “there will still be some people who will be voting for McCain.”


  • MeditatingMeditating Raw Newbie

    JELLIBI – Sometimes reality is mean and painful, like a hole in the head.

  • Jellibi- yeah, I’m at work (fire station full of male republican conservatives) tonight and the guys here all said they think McCain did best. Ugh. Just blows my mind. * In fact, excuse me while I go gag now. * ;) Just goes to show how people see what they want to see though, eh?!

    And I was thinking the EXACT same thing you just said about how could ANYONE still want to vote for McCain.

    Oh, and I just LOvE how McCain commented how he doesn’t need any “on the job training,” that he’s ready to go now. But he sure can’t say that about his VP candidate- in fact it’s exactly the opposite! And for having “so much experience” on Obama, McCain sure didn’t come across impressively over Obama’s relaxed, confident, and assertive stance.

  • Meditating- :) so true!

    aspire- Really?l@$*lsfrandomjibberishwhichshowsthatmymindcantcomprehendwhatijustreadjiejfie#$!!Seriously? What are they thinking?! Yes, I guess people do see what they want to see.

  • Yes, I agree, aspire… the VP debate will be fun to watch next week, won’t it?!

  • RawKidChefRawKidChef Raw Newbie

    Oh my gosh “a hole in their head” I 100% agree! I watched some of the debates last night, and personally I didn’t think either of them were that impressive. If McCain cancelled the debates, he would look like such a wimp. Not that he doesn’t already look like one. I thought Obama, however, was more aggressive and confident than usual. He needs this to win the election. I thought McCain was passively being hostile towards Obama, I mean, he made no eye contact and was disrespectful, as aspire pointed out in another thread. McCain himself has a huge hole in his head. I mean, all he ever talks about is how he’s “honored to meet with the troops”.

    I mean no bias to McCain supporters when I say this. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, Democrats or Republicans, and I respect that.

  • You’re a smart kid, RKC! I, too, thought it was annoying how McCain kept going back to the “honored to meet the troops” thing. He also, over and over again, addressed the veterans rather than the American people as a whole. I guess he’s thinking that that’s where his votes are going to come from—people who support the war.

    It’s hard for me to imagine that there are actually people who support this war.

  • I cringed when McCain talked about a spending freeze for all but the war and veterans…

    Yes the budget needs to be lowered but as a teacher I can tell you 80% of my class materials are out of pocket and I can not afford to pick up the last 20…I can barely afford the 80 I already spend. Education is already horribly underfunded and we already have a blade swinging over our heads with programs such as “no child left behind” which threaten our jobs but give us little to no funding to be successful.

    Course, the debate didn’t change my opinion on who I was voting for.

  • blueyzblueyz Raw Newbie

    I agreed with the comment :) I had already decided who I would vote for out of the two, last night just confirmed it but I do like listening to the debates(lol, must be getting old I used to hate politice). The VP debate should be interesting.

  • LauroliLauroli Raw Newbie

    I like Obama better than that doddering old man, McCain too. BUT, both Obama and McCain support war. Obama thinks we need to redouble our efforts in Afghanistan and “crush” Bin Laden and I believe he mentioned Pakistan as a potential war ground as well. Obama failed to discuss the root causes of terrorism in the first place: one of which is colonialism, which we have practiced flagrantly with our disgusting preemptive war. I think it is ludicrous that you would expect to capture and kill Bin Laden and gain a great victory over terrorism, as Obama suggested. A newer, stronger leader would emerge where he left off. Our war on terrorism is about as effective as our war on drugs. We continually insist on addressing the symptom rather than the cause. The same goes for our amazing health-care industry, which is actually the third leading cause of death in the United States, below heart disease and cancer.

    The attitude we have been acclimated to develop, that you must vote for the lesser of two evils, has led us to accept that a mediocre, corporate government is the only option.

    Ralph Nader has a good analysis of the debates:


  • I hate McCain. He’s such a “military man” and much more adamant about war than Obama is. Obama was actually addressing important issues such as health care while McCain hardly touched on that. McCain wants to open up 400 nuclear power plants around the country to create 700 000 new jobs in the US within a period of time, however his only reason for wanting to open up these plants is to use the nuclear waste for creating more weapons.

    I completely agree with aspire and everything you mentioned above, that was exactly what I was thinking.

    I liked how Obama kept saying “When I’m President..” that was great. lol @ hole in the head and the miss congeniality comment was also hilarious.

    I can’t wait to hear the vp debate next week.

  • lzhptlzhpt Raw Newbie

    I got absolutely nothing out of that debate. Obama had secured my vote until last night. Who are these people anymore? Obama has sold out to whomever is stuffing his pockets. He’s even changed his tune on his energy plan if you listen closely. Nader for president! Obama started his campaign by telling us his passion. Now he’s reading and seems confused by whomever is writing his notes. Where is government for the people? I’m deeply saddened.

  • LauroliLauroli Raw Newbie

    Yay! Go Izhpt! More people need to have your spirit. I was just about to research how I can get involved in Nader’s campaign where I live in Reno. Go Grassroots! Go government by the people, for the people!

  • Right on, doombot and lzhpt. :)

    Nader is getting my support too.

  • RawKidChefRawKidChef Raw Newbie

    Oh no not Nader again. Have you forgotten he gave us 8 years of GEORGE BUSH??? He is EVIL.

    jellibi I agree he he leaving out America as a whole. The regular people are just as important as the veterans. Let’s not let a silly debate interfere who we are voting for. I think the only thing Nader is knowledgeable about is the Green Party and a clean environment, which, I agree, is very important, but is that the only important thing in America? NO! The economy is at stake! As is healthcare and many other issues.

    Obama supporters, don’t lose your hope in him. Just because he changes his opinions on something doesn’t mean he will do harm to our country. He may not be very helpful, but Nader certainly isn’t! Remember, he’s got Biden, and Biden will do some very good things.

    I think in the VP Debate Biden will crush Palin.

  • Nader wants to abolish the criminal Federal Reserve system, which is responsible for nearly all of our economic woes. In fact, all of the third-party candidates are talking about getting rid of the Fed, but Obama and McCain aren’t. They just want to put a band-aid on our broken system (bailout).

    Plus, I just trust Nader, which is something I can’t say about McBama.

  • RawKidChefRawKidChef Raw Newbie

    It’s unlikely enough people will vote for Nader to actually get him elected. Instead, ii will split the Democratic vote and McCain will win. Just like what happened with Gore.

  • LauroliLauroli Raw Newbie

    Kevlar~ You couldn’t be more right. Nader has done more for this country than either Obama or McCain. He has devoted his life to fighting for our environment, advocating consumer rights, and fighting against corporate power. And the idea that NADER gave us 8 years of GEORGE BUSH is absurd, RawKidChef. I hate to tell you, but WE (American voters) and our screwed electoral system are to blame for Bush’s 8 year term.

  • lzhptlzhpt Raw Newbie

    That’s just it..I’ve always gone with my gut and i so admired Obama’s passion. I’m sure he’s tired. The country’s gone to hell since he started his campaign and now some of the issues he’s been talking about since writing his book are well…old. We are in a different place now. I was looking for him to be on it and he missed it. I’ve lost my trust in him. Seems like he’ll go whichever direction he’s pulled now. A year ago, Obama was up there with Christianne Amanpour for people I’d most like to have lunch with. Now? He seems like the little pageant girl..it’s like someone spun him around, put a bunch of make-up on him, notes in hand and threw him out on the stage. I’d be confused too. The party should let him do what he wants-sink or swim. BTW-was it me, or did every question come back to some ancient battle in some far away land for Mccain? SNOOOORE!

  • LauroliLauroli Raw Newbie

    RawKidChef~ You should take a look at the video I posted below. Nader explains exactly why he Gore lost his campaign.


  • RawKidChefRawKidChef Raw Newbie

    Okay, maybe your right, but what if it splits the Democrat vote? It’s not that I oppose Nader, it’s just I’m afraid McCain would win.

    EDIT: Thanks. I’ll check it out.

  • JoyceHJoyceH Raw Newbie

    Hi everyone – only have a few minutes to check in tonight….I have to say I’m with RawKidChef and that a vote for Nadar is really a vote for McCain. I do remember reading from a trusted source that the the Bush Administration helped finance Nadar for this exact purpose….if anyone is completely torn (between Obama and a third party), please think of all the animals in this country that don’t have a voice on those horrific factory farms and the ones facing extinction due to destruction of their habitats. Palin is an extremely scary prospect for animals and all the progress made by animal right activists and the National level Humane Society and other equally passionate non profit organizations devoted to animals. The Humane Society of the United States is endorsing Obama b/c of their utter fear of Palin. I honestly trust the HSUS for so many reasons. Please see my thread I posted on Friday regarding the HSUS endorsing Obama/Biden. please please please do not forget all the animals need us!!! :-)

    Izhpt – I respect your opinions of the debates and now wished I’d spent more time listening to the ‘old Obama’. However I was just consumed with other stuff happening in my life at that time and have been playing ‘catch up’ (but in a very rigorous manner!). I thought Obama was a very articulate and extremely well spoken individual last night. He’s a gifted speaker for sure and didn’t back down one bit. McCain was on the offensive, but Obama was able to stand up and set the record straight. With only 2 minutes alloted for each speech, I would imagine it’s very tricky to put so many words into such a tiny allotment of time….McCain was just dismal. My husband couldn’t even stay awake! I had to take his glass of wine out of his hand twice when he was nodding off during McCain’s long drawn out babbble.

    Obama seemed to me pretty sincere about education and healthcare for the lower and middle class which seems pretty urgent right now. I also had to shudder when McCain mentioned a spending freeze with the exception of war veterans and the military. I was outraged when McCain said that Americans need to take care of themselves in regards to healthcare. Does he even have a clue about the astronomical costs of going to a doctor, specialist or the hospital or emergency room (god forbid as that could cost thousands of dollars) If a struggling family doesn’t have health insurance and some catastrophic illness or accident happens, how are they supposed to ‘take care of themselves’ when our current healthcare system would bankrupt this family or put them into a debt so big they couldn’t pay their mortgage. McCain is so goddamned out of touch with reality that it is truly upsetting and outrageous. I was furious with him for that comment!!!!!I’m not saying the govt should 100% regulate healthcare but at least Obama recognizes that there is a huge problem in this country. Oh my gosh, I won’t even go into the lack of education in this country….The fact that McCain didn’t even address basic necessities of the working class made me livid and truly disgusted. At least Obama recognizes the needs of struggling families.

    I’m not politically savvy. I lost a lot of hope after Kerry lost 4 years ago. The country’s now so much worse off then 4 years ago. (not to mention 8 yrs ago). Will I ever be able to go back to Europe and not be embarrassed b/c I was born in America and sport a very generic American accent? We know what will happen with McCain. I say let’s give Obama the benefit of any doubts. He’s not perfect but he’s the best I’ve seem in a very very very long time….....Ok, gotta sign off for now

    cheers :-) x

  • I’m not a very political saavy person, and this is kind of off topic, But Obama is a total hottie! He can be my president anytime. That is not why I’m voting for him though :-)

  • JoyceHJoyceH Raw Newbie

    AzulBlue02034, Yes yes yes! Obama is a hottie and I kept thinking that he is very handsome during the debate last night ;-)

    Nothing wrong with that in my book :-D

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